levy120
Guardian
Muushuuuu~
currently working on: fanfic overload and reviews
Posts: 945
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Post by levy120 on Jan 31, 2010 9:36:33 GMT -5
Discuss here the 2009 Live Action Movie =)
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Post by rocketharuka on Jan 31, 2010 10:52:07 GMT -5
Thank you Levy. I love you XDD
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levy120
Guardian
Muushuuuu~
currently working on: fanfic overload and reviews
Posts: 945
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Post by levy120 on Jan 31, 2010 13:31:59 GMT -5
Alright, I was actually quite positively surprised by this movie, even with the lack of Mushu xD
And you know what? Watching this movie makes me think that the Deng story might have turned out just right, after all =)
AND THEY WERE ALL COVERED IN SNO- I MEAN SAND XD
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araeph
Specter
TEH MASTER
Posts: 55
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Post by araeph on Jan 31, 2010 19:17:34 GMT -5
Waaargh! Oh, this movie, this movie, this movie. I must say I had the opposite reaction as Levy. It could have been excellent. It faaaaaailed. [CAUTION: Spoilers ahead!] Principal problem: the first act is too speedy and too thin. The script breezes through: character exposition. Mulan's and her father's. Nine minutes in, and Mulan's already off to war. That's too short a time for us to get to know Mulan and her father, and the strength of the bond between them. Hence, there is not nearly as much at stake emotionally as there should be over this supposedly catalyst event. Mulan, by the way, took almost twice as long to get to the same point, despite having a shorter running time. DO NOT RUSH YOUR OPENING, moviemakers! It will weaken the entire rest of the story. The script breezes through: the difficulty of fitting in at camp. Mulan is almost instantly discovered, twice. First, in a "D'oh!" humorous kind of way, except it's not funny, and then in a way that could be humiliating or sexy, depending on which way you play it, yet it somehow manages to be neither. Come ON, guys! "Woman dresses up as a man to go to war." The drama/tension/comedy softballs from a plotline like that are FLYING AT YOU, slow-motion style! Is it too much to ask for you to hit one of them? The script breezes through: character development among the soldiers. Are any of them as endearing as Yao, Ling, or Chien-Po? And do we care in more than a remote, "Aww, too bad" kind of way when they die? The script breezes through: villain build-up. Mendu lazily goes about his obligatory villainy, without any real passion or force behind his actions. At least Mulan is still quite likeable; I found myself missing Shan-Yu. "How many men does it take to deliver a message?" "...One!" If you can't equal that, don't bother trying. And his war cry? No contest. At first, I thought maybe they rushed through all the in-depth, character-oriented parts to get to the cool, epic action sequences. But the first attack comes before we know any of the characters really well, so it isn't as dramatic as it should be. And then all of a sudden, we fast-forward through all the other battle sequences without being given a chance to feel anything for anyone except the main character. Or even witness someone getting his butt kicked in a satisfying way. The final battle is pretty well done, but again, we don't really feel for these soldiers as we should, because we've hardly been introduced to them. There's a heroic sacrifice that could have been incredibly poignant...if the first third of the movie had done its job right. Other problems: I wish there had been an ongoing inward struggle as well as an outward one. Mulan already knows kung fu, so she doesn't have to strive and sweat in order to train. When the jade pendant goes missing, which is the only real trial she undergoes to hide her identity, does she have to rack her brains and think up a way to save her own life? Nope; bing, bang, boom, false confession, imprisonment, release. No tension, no time for real suspense. When she first goes into battle, she mows down the rouran like grass. She talks about being afraid, but I'm not really inclined to believe her. I did not like the fact that Mulan became a drunkard and neglected her men because she thought the man she loved was dead. I'm glad she's a well-rounded character, with flaws and all that, but this should not have been one of them. Which segues nicely into another problem: the romance! Stop. Having. Romance. As. The. Center. Plotline. This is true of the Disney sequel, this is true of most Mulan fanfic, and this is true of the live-action movie. Why do I say this? Because most folk ballads center on romance. But the Tale of Mulan does not. It's about one woman's loyalty to her father and her fatherland. And if that's not the mainstay of the story, the tale has lost something. Also disappointing was the fact that I could accept Vicki Zhao as a loyal daughter, a woman in love, a fighter...but I just couldn't believe in her as a leader. Frankly, she didn't have the charisma for it. When she's giving speeches, she sounds like a little girl about to cry. Just put yourself in the shoes of one of her soldiers, pretend you don't know she's a girl, and listen to 15 seconds of her speechifying. Would you really be convinced that she was a man, let alone a general? And then there's the good ole token white guy, Vitas. But since the less said about his opening the movie, the better, I won't dwell on his...*snerk*...performance. You know what would have made this movie and all its characters more lovable? Awkwardness. Intentional, affectionate, humanizing awkwardness. When you think about it, you'll see what I mean.
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levy120
Guardian
Muushuuuu~
currently working on: fanfic overload and reviews
Posts: 945
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Post by levy120 on Feb 1, 2010 1:00:27 GMT -5
"DO NOT RUSH YOUR OPENING, moviemakers! It will weaken the entire rest of the story." Well, yeah. But the opposite is not quite productive as well, I like to think there of "Fantastic Four" and "Wall-E" which were just brilliant movies to watch the first time, but... Would I want to watch them again like they are or just skip into a movie from a certain part? Because the beginnings of those are hell-long. I know the friend I saw Wall-E with in cinema was actually pretty bored by it, until the last 10 minutes, and I can't help to see the Fantastic Four opening more than twice in a row. I was suprirsed that it was pretty short yes, but I prolly didn't bother as much because I had the background knowledge. To be honest, I didn't find the Romance in THIS movie as Pushy as it was in the Disney Version. They might have had more personal (luckily no body- ;D) contact, but they were always talking about the battlefield and... uh, yes. Death. Very romantic topic to cut on. Well for the missing "awkwardness" I believe it's just the fact that the whole "Honor box" comes into play here. They prolly didn't want to play "ridiculous" at some point :/ And after all it, IS a war movie. I love how Disney accomplished to make something like that child-friendly, but really if you think about it, it's creepy xD (Mulan being one of the bloodiest Disney movie with the most death in it, and a beheaded guy and being FSK 0 AND UNCUT - Hell yes, big fish there <3) And it's dry, but not as dry as I might have expected. I'm particulary fond of this movie, just because I know OTHER Asian movies and they never really got to me at any point. Unless they had Jackie Chan - lul Now imagine Jackie Chan in this movie, do you think that would have made it better? Really? I don't think so. Normally I would give you the advise to watch it as a normal movie, without any previous knowledge and then later on, start a comparison, but I'd be a hypocrate because I was making comparisons at any chance that I got as well xD And even if this movies are so different, in style, characters and... let's say the detailed plot - I couldn't help but grin at all the similiarities. The Hot Spring and the Pond The Poison Dragon and the Avalanche The basically final execution disguised as a woman Stuff like that ^^ I found it rather weird though that she just walked up into that camp without a cover name.
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araeph
Specter
TEH MASTER
Posts: 55
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Post by araeph on Feb 1, 2010 6:59:47 GMT -5
"DO NOT RUSH YOUR OPENING, moviemakers! It will weaken the entire rest of the story." Well, yeah. But the opposite is not quite productive as well, I like to think there of "Fantastic Four" and "Wall-E" which were just brilliant movies to watch the first time, but... Would I want to watch them again like they are or just skip into a movie from a certain part? Because the beginnings of those are hell-long. I know the friend I saw Wall-E with in cinema was actually pretty bored by it, until the last 10 minutes, and I can't help to see the Fantastic Four opening more than twice in a row. I was suprirsed that it was pretty short yes, but I prolly didn't bother as much because I had the background knowledge. Exactly. My point is that people without your background knowledge or participation in the "Mulan" fandom will not be able to identify with the characters as much as you have. I do appreciate their physical restraint with these characters, but I'm not sure how much pushier you can get when the last lines of the movie are basically, "You were what made me get up in the morning for the past twelve years! Thank you, Wentai!" and when both Wentai and Mulan were willing, at least temporarily, to sacrifice their honor for each other. (Wentai, when he was willing to run off with Mulan and thus abandon the peace he had fought for all those years; Mulan, when it took a subordinate soldier to get her to do her job after Wentai's "death," even though she's seen plenty of death before now. I'm not saying that they had to do slapstick. I'm saying that the moviemakers didn't appreciate or give full weight to the awkwardness of Mulan trying to pass herself off as a man. And more generally, that these characters weren't fully realized as human beings without at least a little gallows humor. What is "FSK 0 AND UNCUT"? *grin* I don't think so, either. Most Chinese movies, I've watched for their visuals alone, and they work very well on that level. Well...that's exactly what I did. The rushed beginning and the lack of in-depth characterization wouldn't have bothered me nearly as much if I had combined the two movies in my head. I could have filled in the gaps with the character development in Disney's version. But as I sat there, I tried to picture characters that I'd never heard of before, and thought, "They're not really giving these people much to work with, are they? If I didn't have the Disney version for reference, I wouldn't be moved at all by her sacrifice." The father with the walking stick Black Wind and Khan Yep. I know. Doesn't her name mean "magnolia blossom"? Kinda hard to picture a male soldier walking up and going, "Hey, the name's Magnolia, nice to meet you"!
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Post by porcelainwarrior on Feb 1, 2010 23:19:05 GMT -5
I agree with Araeph... My main reason is that the film somehow gave me the feeling there was something missing.
Well, as I mentioned on D.A... I had very high expectations for this movie. Sadly they weren't quite fulfilled.
Firstly, I assumed it would be an action/adventure movie...but the way I perceived it, it was more focused on the drama. (Not that I don't enjoy drama). However, I expected the battle scenes to have a greater visual impact on me. I thought there'd be more kung fu, swords clashing...I wanted to see the struggle between the soldiers and the barbarians.
Then, well some details like Mulan fitting into the army so easily, with so few complications. I just couldn't understand. Keeping her real name without being mocked, and when Wen tai learned she was a girl his reaction was so smooth...you'd expect at least some shock.
Moreover, the issue seemed to be solved so easily. I might watch it again soon to gain a better perspective...this was just my first impression.
I'm not saying I didn't like it, I just prefer the Disney version =)...And believe me there was a part of me that was afraid of watching the live action movie because I thought it would spoil the animated version...but no, it made me appreciate it more than I already do.
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levy120
Guardian
Muushuuuu~
currently working on: fanfic overload and reviews
Posts: 945
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Post by levy120 on Feb 2, 2010 13:28:42 GMT -5
(Wentai, when he was willing to run off with Mulan and thus abandon the peace he had fought for all those years; He's a MAN, what do you expect? Wasn't that subordinate Tiger? I thought he'd held a let's say higher position as a personal friend unlike a normal "subordinate" there, so he might as well just have been her reason. Hum... no I think that would have crossed the line for the producers there as well. After all that movie is about honor and all, you know. I dunno, when I see a Chinese Movie I don't even expect humor in first place. Most Animes are pretty dry as well, so I just stopped hoping. FSK is basically the German version of the "Rating" and the Number behind there is the Age from which upwards people are allowed to watch this movie. I think FSK 0 is PG in America The next one would be FSK 6 (older Children), FSK 12 (Teenagers), FSK 16 (Blood/Violence) and FSK 18 (Sex) I'm still a little confused with the US ratings, I've just grown familiar with the fanfiction.net ratings... it's all really confusing. Age termed ratings are pretty understandable if you ignore the shortcut (which means voluntary self-control btw). Uncut should be self explanatory. A lot of movies get cut over here. Basically Tarzan lost half of the Sabor Fight and Lilo & Stitch was robbed of 75% of its finale. So there. Mulan is a gem. I thought there'd be more kung fu, swords clashing...I wanted to see the struggle between the soldiers and the barbarians. Yeah that was kinda disappointing actually. I'm looking forward to that kind of subject in school already <3 Also, since I think that might have come of wrong... I wouldn't buy this movie. It was nice for watching one time and to enlighten your horizon and all (good stuff to work with for future fanfics as reference). But I was merely so fond of the movies, because unlike you two I had no expectations at ALL into this movie, I basically couldn't be disappointed ;D And one more thing ~ For the split of a second, I actually saw Mushu in that movie - with my inner eye And trust me people, I'm not crazy. [19:34] Haruka: the character you say...is Wentai? the guy who shouts the name of Mulan at first, or another character? [19:35] levy120: so you get the drift huh? I just see Mushu sliding down the avalanche of sno... I MEAN SAND [19:35] levy120: SAND xD [19:35] Haruka: YES exactly! XD [19:35] levy120: Geez, we are freaks xD
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alliriyan
Ghost
The Plotinator
I BBQ plotbunnies for breakfast ;D
Posts: 49
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Post by alliriyan on Feb 2, 2010 14:33:20 GMT -5
Chinese is such a repetitive language that Mulan could probably pass as a male name too. The whole 'Fa Ping' thing was a pun. Originally she is called Hua Mulan in the story, which is 'flower' and 'magnolia', for the Disney film they made it Fa (different dialect, still flower) and Ping which means vase or pot. Flowerpot.
Hey guys, I got into uni at last, I'll be doing Chinese and Creative Writing - EPIC COMBINATION XDDD
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araeph
Specter
TEH MASTER
Posts: 55
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Post by araeph on Feb 2, 2010 22:15:56 GMT -5
Ooh, congratulations, Alliriyan! And thanks for sharing what you know of Chinese names.
@levy: Similarly, I am not about to burst into a ball of fiery rage at this movie. There were some parts I did like, and it definitely got better as it went along. But, like I said, the movie's first act hurt it badly, and I maintain that, whether about honor or not, the movie needed to make the characters more human.
See, here's the thing. If you have characters who never fall off their horses, never mess up, never make stupid mistakes, never get embarrassed, then you have characters who aren't human. And yeah, it sure is understandable when characters who are smooth and skilled from the get-go fulfill their duties calmly and refffspectfully and reflect before they snack act...but it's so much better when characters just like you and me uphold their own honor, too. At least, that's how I see it.
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Post by chengshao on Feb 20, 2011 19:03:30 GMT -5
I loved this movie! I prefer the Disney and I can see many issues, but...a live-action Mulan movie with Jackie Chans son?! (Jaycee Chan) It's just so awesome
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levy120
Guardian
Muushuuuu~
currently working on: fanfic overload and reviews
Posts: 945
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Post by levy120 on Feb 21, 2011 1:24:08 GMT -5
You make that sound like a horde of Gary Stus, Araeph ;D Huh... which reminds me... Wasn't there supposed to be a SECOND Live Action movie coming out too? That one being directed by Disney? I think I heard about that at some point. Edit: Yeppers perezhilton.com/2010-07-28-disneys-mulan-goes-live-action-and-3dVoice Problems of Eddie Murfy? I DON'T CARE - I'll get the dubbed version anyway <3 And I sure hope they do this movie before Otto Waalkes goes pension, because I would not want a Bernd Simon there :x
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Post by fluffybunny on Feb 21, 2011 6:49:12 GMT -5
You make that sound like a horde of Gary Stus, Araeph ;D Oh dear lord xD i dont know whether to be pleased or not about this. I mean sure its great for making more fans, but how much are they going to mess up the chars/story. Also >3>' Chi fu had better be in there or I'll be totally missing him thoughout it. I hope he gets a good actor S: Kinda both looking forward and kinda not to it
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eline
Imagination
Posts: 141
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Post by eline on Feb 25, 2011 5:04:50 GMT -5
Better prepare,there already is a poster.
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levy120
Guardian
Muushuuuu~
currently working on: fanfic overload and reviews
Posts: 945
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Post by levy120 on Feb 25, 2011 17:21:51 GMT -5
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